Vinci Car Parking Charges
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Wrexham is the 153rd biggest town in the UK (out of 7,339) by population. That is quite significant. The only official or comparative statistic on economic output and earnings shows a drop in the UK index from 98 points in 1997, to 84 percentage points in 2011 … a drop of 14%.
This suggests that Wrexham is maintaining its mass of people, but not its capacity to drive money through its economy. Do we have the right ‘offer’ for the customer? If not, and we had the right offer, would people then be prepared to pay the car park charges?
At the root of how much money flows through a local economy is the scale and activity of business and jobs. Various strategies have been published that recite how and what should be acheived … but if we are in the current situation, what should we do differently
In respect of public car parks, the revenue is so small compared to the £227m spend in the overall budget … the community debate and action (led by the Council because someone has to lead) needs to be how do we ‘offer’ a great town and increase our trading and monetary throughput …
I am heartily sick of reading how great this town is. The people who have that view are likely to be the very ones who, apart from weekly supermarket trip or the journey to their jobs, rarely step over the threshold of their cosy suburban semi.
On the other hand, there are those who frequently observe the drunks, addicts, beggars and the like who inhabit Wrexham town centre on a daily basis. And by their own admission, find it intimidating to say the least.
Then turn to the night time economy which fares little better.
In recently published figures from North Wales Police, 7 out of the top 10 streets in North Wales that have recorded crime figures, are in Wrexham. The offences range from anti social behaviour, drug crime, burglary, vehicle crime, robbery, bicycle theft, shoplifting and most worrying of all, violent and sexual crime.
ASDA, incidentally, has more shoplifting offences than anywhere else in Wales.
To an extent, the Police have to answer for these shameful figures and become more proactive to eradicate, or at the very least, diminish the problem. Yet the still maintain that criminal activity is on the decline.
To blame WCBC for the continued decline in the fortunes of Wrexham town centre by minimal increases in parking fees, if it wasn’t so pathetic would be laughable.
Those who perpetuate the myth that ‘Wrexham is great’, wake up and smell the coffee before it really is too late.Oddly enough, I actually agree with Benjamin about the state of Wrexham. I agree with Swan as well. Firstly, the town has major major problems. Secondly, I don’t blame Wrexham Council for much of what is wrong. This would be silly.
I’m not sure who out there spins a myth about the town being great, equally, I have read many people writing about a town in such negative terms that it is equally silly.
Let’s all be realistic. If we want to use stats, there are some disturbing stats about our town. Scary. Equally, if we look at the strengths, potential and actual, there is much to be optimistic about……that is providing we actually do something about it. Whilst Benjamin seems to offer a prognosis that little can be done, there are many people out there, many on this forum, who offer some solutions to problems. I understand Benjamin that merely adjusting the Car Park charges will be a negligible move towards turning the town round. Equally, I also understand that the Car Park charges have emptied the People’s Market Car Park on any afternoon that you care to mention and this has impacted on the traders below. There are thousands of little things that would have to change in Wrexham to make it blossom but I am happy to trudge along to a range of meetings to try and play a small part in identifying what they are and doing something about it.
Manchester Metropolitan University have already pointed out the competitive advantages that Wrexham enjoys over many other struggling towns and Wrexham’s Retail occupancy rate is much higher than a whole range of towns. Geographically, the town is well positioned to undertake business and could pick up trade from the Welsh hinterland and across the border. Individual businesses like Martin Rees have produced a town trail map to help promote the town’s heritage and others promote the town in their own way.
I quite agree with Benjamin about all of his observations. The town is not great and it would be laughable to claim it. I have decried the School provision and the past management of the 3 Markets has been appalling. What I find even more laughable than this, however, is that certain individuals would appear to suggest that nothing can be done about the weaknesses we can all see and/or there is no point in even trying. The idea that we are a backwater, so what is the point. Let’s all put up the white flag and surrender. Shameful
@BenjaminM 14254 wrote:
I am heartily sick of reading how great this town is …
Those who perpetuate the myth that ‘Wrexham is great’, wake up and smell the coffee before it really is too late.
The town is home to 60,000 people, and the County 130,000. The area has demonstrated (in modern history) the ability, to deliver very good education, health, and lead on business sectors such as engineering. (Although some educational establishments may be going through special measures, and health may have dangerous bottle necks in places).
Based on much of the foundation created in our communities and by our parents, many of us have been lucky to travel way beyond “a cosy threshold”, and have experience of many comparables … good and bad no doubt. Probably on each continent and in hundreds of towns around the world.
The mention of behavior observed on Wrexham’s streets, both in the day and in its night time economy, and the what sounds like above average recorded crime, is clearly not good, and needs parents and friends to set values and standards, followed by a strong economy to provide a worthwhile future and good earnings, and then the police to promote normal order and peace on the streets and in our communities. While the police are asked to address the levels of crime, this must surely be part of a single community responsibility to lead by example, and to provide a solid economy (and earnings) and a life that is fulfilling … good schools, health, recreation, some fun.
The community Leadership is central to this.
On car parks. If a private global operator is asking a price that is not value for money, people will go elsewhere. But at 14 percentage points down in economic performance, it will get to a point were we question whether the economic condition is reversible. But every town and place has its challenges. Some EU countries remain quite desperate compared to our local situation.
While private operators charge what they do; what should Wrexham charge and why … and how does this fit in with a whole economic strategy for the town …
Taking the definition of the word ‘great’, another word is majestic … and no doubt Wrexham took that place in the regional economy once upon a time, and it still has the people and the DNA that created that majestic period.
Wrexham will be as great or majestic as we want it to be, and car parking fees and a warm welcome are one element of the ‘offer’ that we give to our customers. The customer will judge us on the totality. Car parking fees, and the people that customers see and approach them on the street, along with cleanliness, and the retail, business and aesthetic offer, all determine whether we are going up or down with our offer.
@Alunh 14266 wrote:
What I find even more laughable than this, however, is that certain individuals would appear to suggest that nothing can be done about the weaknesses we can all see and/or there is no point in even trying. The idea that we are a backwater, so what is the point. Let’s all put up the white flag and surrender. Shameful
Laughable? I’m not laughing I’m afraid. You see, those that you refer to, those who rant about the demise of the town at any given opportunity, are not those that should concern you. You should be turning your attention to the vast majority of defeatists who don’t care enough to log-on to a forum for a good moan, thesaurus in hand. The weekend travellers who spend their valuable free time where they feel more comfortable and where the offer is better. The evening spenders who travel far and wide in search of good food, good drink and civilised surroundings. The silent movement of young parents (and parents-to-be) out to the surrounding villages and beyond, terrified of the thought of a Wrexham education. Most relevant of all (coming from someone who lives, works and socialises with people from outside of the area) are the young, skilled, professional workers taking jobs in the general area (Cheshire, Flintshire, Wrexham etc) who don’t even give a moments consideration of making Wrexham their home – the steep property premiums elsewhere seen as good value in comparison.
Oh, and I do lay the blame squarely at the council. At least a small, but significant, division of it. I’m rather surprised that anyone would think otherwise – when you have several councillors and officers presiding over the economic development and management of the town for almost two decades in some cases, who else is more deserving of finger pointing when the economic development and town centre management go to pot..?
I had the unfortunate pleasure of visiting the centre today, hence the slightly sharper tone of today’s rant. Wow. Sunday in Wrexham town centre. All the charm, appeal and vibrancy of a Chernobyl bus stop. Actually the walk from Regent St to High St had me imagining a one-off Jeremy Kyle special set in the Star Wars bar. I had to think hard but I reckon that was probably my 5th visit to town this year. And I live less than 2 miles away. Every visit has been uncomfortable, unpleasant and born out of necessity. The wheels appear to be coming off the Eagles Meadow happy train too, the only remaining sanctuary for those without neck-tattoos, dirty grey tracksuits and a Greggs pasty belt holster, free when you collect 10,000 pasty points apparently.
So what to do? Well we’ve been here before on many threads but let’s recap the favourites.
Local craft and produce. It’s in vogue, it pulls people in and we’re blessed with being surrounded by it. Except you wouldn’t think so would you? So what we need is monthly (let’s start slow) evening and/or weekend gatherings of the best the area has to offer. No stall fees, no silly covenants, all costs covered using the local food WAG funding. Just straightforward stalls, customers and lots of advertising. We could call it a Market.
Evening economy. I’ve been fortunate enough to travel a bit. Even in the most desolate, tin-pot, communist hole of a town, there were bustling bars, cafes and restaurants full of civilised people enjoying a civilised time. Now for those of you mentally mumbling ‘that would never work in Wrexham’ do me favour. Tomorrow (Monday) evening pop down to the Pant in Gresford. When you finally find a table, take some time to count how many orders are going through during the evening. I’d like to have a wager that the Pant takes more on a Monday evening than all the town centre restaurants take Monday to Thursday. Any takers? Now that’s not a different County. It’s 2 miles from the town centre. 2 miles. The biggest myth about Wrexham is that everybody within a 10 mile radius is on the bones of their ass and has no disposable income. Balls. Just because there aren’t hordes of people moping around the town centre every evening looking for somewhere to go, doesn’t mean the demand is not there. The demand is there and it is huge.
What’s on offer. If we’re particularly fed up we’ll head out to one of the garden centres. The Moreton, Bellis’ or the Grosvenor. Why? Because large garden centres like these have diversified far beyond plants and now offer interesting bits and bobs, good value food and a comfortable environment. A nice pleasant way to pass an hour or two. What on earth has happened that has led to garden centres being more attractive destinations that Wrexham centre? As with the Evening economy point above, even on a Sunday, there demand is out there. What Wrexham has to offer simply has to change.
I’m boring myself now so I’ll wrap up. All I’d like to finish on is this. If you want to see the result of a town where nobody chooses to live there, visit Rhyl. If you also want to see an example of a council in blissful denial who believes all troubles can be swept away with a PR campaign, visit http://www.LoveRhyl.co.uk
@Adam 14268 wrote:
Laughable? I’m not laughing I’m afraid. You see, those that you refer to, those who rant about the demise of the town at any given opportunity, are not those that should concern you. You should be turning your attention to the vast majority of defeatists who don’t care enough to log-on to a forum for a good moan, thesaurus in hand. The weekend travellers who spend their valuable free time where they feel more comfortable and where the offer is better. The evening spenders who travel far and wide in search of good food, good drink and civilised surroundings. The silent movement of young parents (and parents-to-be) out to the surrounding villages and beyond, terrified of the thought of a Wrexham education. Most relevant of all (coming from someone who lives, works and socialises with people from outside of the area) are the young, skilled, professional workers taking jobs in the general area (Cheshire, Flintshire, Wrexham etc) who don’t even give a moments consideration of making Wrexham their home – the steep property premiums elsewhere seen as good value in comparison.
Oh, and I do lay the blame squarely at the council. At least a small, but significant, division of it. I’m rather surprised that anyone would think otherwise – when you have several councillors and officers presiding over the economic development and management of the town for almost two decades in some cases, who else is more deserving of finger pointing when the economic development and town centre management go to pot..?
I had the unfortunate pleasure of visiting the centre today, hence the slightly sharper tone of today’s rant. Wow. Sunday in Wrexham town centre. All the charm, appeal and vibrancy of a Chernobyl bus stop. Actually the walk from Regent St to High St had me imagining a one-off Jeremy Kyle special set in the Star Wars bar. I had to think hard but I reckon that was probably my 5th visit to town this year. And I live less than 2 miles away. Every visit has been uncomfortable, unpleasant and born out of necessity. The wheels appear to be coming off the Eagles Meadow happy train too, the only remaining sanctuary for those without neck-tattoos, dirty grey tracksuits and a Greggs pasty belt holster, free when you collect 10,000 pasty points apparently.
So what to do? Well we’ve been here before on many threads but let’s recap the favourites.
Local craft and produce. It’s in vogue, it pulls people in and we’re blessed with being surrounded by it. Except you wouldn’t think so would you? So what we need is monthly (let’s start slow) evening and/or weekend gatherings of the best the area has to offer. No stall fees, no silly covenants, all costs covered using the local food WAG funding. Just straightforward stalls, customers and lots of advertising. We could call it a Market.
Evening economy. I’ve been fortunate enough to travel a bit. Even in the most desolate, tin-pot, communist hole of a town, there were bustling bars, cafes and restaurants full of civilised people enjoying a civilised time. Now for those of you mentally mumbling ‘that would never work in Wrexham’ do me favour. Tomorrow (Monday) evening pop down to the Pant in Gresford. When you finally find a table, take some time to count how many orders are going through during the evening. I’d like to have a wager that the Pant takes more on a Monday evening than all the town centre restaurants take Monday to Thursday. Any takers? Now that’s not a different County. It’s 2 miles from the town centre. 2 miles. The biggest myth about Wrexham is that everybody within a 10 mile radius is on the bones of their ass and has no disposable income. Balls. Just because there aren’t hordes of people moping around the town centre every evening looking for somewhere to go, doesn’t mean the demand is not there. The demand is there and it is huge.
What’s on offer. If we’re particularly fed up we’ll head out to one of the garden centres. The Moreton, Bellis’ or the Grosvenor. Why? Because large garden centres like these have diversified far beyond plants and now offer interesting bits and bobs, good value food and a comfortable environment. A nice pleasant way to pass an hour or two. What on earth has happened that has led to garden centres being more attractive destinations that Wrexham centre? As with the Evening economy point above, even on a Sunday, there demand is out there. What Wrexham has to offer simply has to change.
I’m boring myself now so I’ll wrap up. All I’d like to finish on is this. If you want to see the result of a town where nobody chooses to live there, visit Rhyl. If you also want to see an example of a council in blissful denial who believes all troubles can be swept away with a PR campaign, visit http://www.LoveRhyl.co.uk
This is another one of those rare posts that sums up Wrexham as it is now and what the majority of the people of Wrexham think.
I live about half a mile from Wrexham right on the bus route and my next door neighbors have not been into Wrexham for over two years now and there will be thousands and thousands who are like that who live in Wrexham all because of the reasons listed above, I still do go more in hope I think ..:confused::confused:
I think the parking charges are completely relevant to the towns demise – if people look elsewhere and find they can get more value for money by not having high parking charges, then that will have a direct effect on the amount of people visiting the town.
I don’t think anyone here is suggesting the high parking charges are to blame for all the towns woes, but whilst they are in place it’s hard to see how the town can ever even begin to attract more people.
You can charge whatever you want for parking, if the reason to park is there. Wrexham is a dead town centre; it’s not a destination, it’s barely a stopping-over point. I live two minutes from the town centre, and if I need to go and do anything other than super-budget shopping, I go to Chester.
I’m skint, so I stay in Wrexham, but that’s neither here nor there.
There is nothing in Wrexham town centre to attract anyone. Eagles Meadow could be great, simply due to the better, bigger shop units. The council should bite the bullet and look at redeveloping vast swathes of the town centre. No bigger shops are going to go into pokey, old-fashioned units surrounded by tat shops.
Discount UK, or whatever name they’ve come up with this week; it’s an anchor shop here. But the anchor is all rusted, and it’s got no chain attached.
It is the put of town shopping centres that are leaching the trade from towns and cities. M&S have even shut half their store in Chester so no one is immune.
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