Centre 67 named as building set to be demolished as secret meeting decision half-reversed

Centre 67 in Rhosddu has been officially named as the building due to be knocked down, with previously secret information made public.

Yesterday’s meeting of the Customers, Performance, Resources and Governance Scrutiny Committee was due to be held entirely in private, however internal discussions at the council appear to have found a way to have some of the debate in public at the last minute.

All documents were effectively private prior to the meeting, however it emerged during the course of business Cllr Carrie Harper had signed the call in document – which meant she could not chair the meeting as would be usual. The Deputy Chair was absent, so Cllr Morris was elected temporary Chair to run the meeting.

The committee and viewing public was told a secret pre-meeting was held to “look at the way forward that we can be as open and transparent as we can be”.

Clr Morris explained: “Obviously, there are certain issues that we will need to discuss, or may want to discuss, in more detail which are perhaps sensitive and involved figures that we would need to do in part two.

“I understand from the legal officer that the Leader of the Council is happy for the building to be named.”

Cllr Morris pointed out that the identity of the building ‘was no great secret’ and ‘everyone knows already’.

The move to secrecy was delayed with Cllrs Marc Jones and Pritchard both addressing the committee regarding the call in and the Centre 67 building.

Cllr Marc Jones said he was ‘grateful’ that at least part of the discussion was in Part 1 public session rather than the secret Part 2, “I’m grateful that we’re able to have it in part one in open session because that was the point of having this call in, the five members who signed the call in did so on the basis that there was a principal involved.

Cllr Jones pointed out that time could have been saved if the discussion had taken place part in public and part in secret at the previous ‘special’ Executive Board meeting.

He added: “The reason why I felt so strongly about this was because it is an important building and part of the heritage in my ward. Because the decision had been taken in private, I was unable to discuss this with people. I was unable to discuss this with residents, and I wasn’t able to discuss it with people who I know have a commercial interest in purchasing this property.”

“I think it is an important issue that we can’t just allow to be held behind closed doors, my concern was that how things stood, and we hadn’t done this, we would have ended up with a bulldozers moving in and that would have been the first time that people would have been aware of it and it would have been too late.

“I don’t think that’s the way we should be operating as a council.

Clr Marc Jones adds he is old enough to remember town centre building being knocked down one Sunday morning, as well as issues around the old Veg Market. Says Council should not make same mistakes as the past.

— Wrexham.com (@wrexham) February 4, 2020

Future use of the site was also mention, with the possibility of social housing on the site referenced throughout the public section of the meeting.

Cllr Jones said: “I’ve got nearly 500 people waiting on the council housing list for Rhosddu.

“I believe that’s the largest, the biggest demand in any ward. I’m very keen to see that wider site developed for social housing. I think this could be part of that development, and I don’t see it as a hindrance to that development.”

Council Leader Mark Pritchard also addressed the meeting, replying to Cllr Jones: “I was a little bit surprised and disappointed that there was a point of order raised that the Executive Board by the local elected member, Cllr Marc Jones.”

“I met Marc Jones in late December 2017 and the elected member supported the demolition of the building, subject to a discussion and caveats about social housing on that site, and I respect that.”

Cllr Pritchard went on to detail the history of the site, noting that a decision to knock down Centre 67 was taken in early 2012 and “…steps have been taken to prepare the building for demolition with the removal of the utilities gas, water, electric etc”. He went on to explain that there is ‘no need’ for the building by Wrexham Council and it has been offered for use to all departments with no take up.

The secrecy of the decision was explained as not just involving commercial sensitive costings over demolition but also staff implications at service providers on the wider site, calling all the issues a ‘bigger picture’ than just the identity of the building.

Clr Pritchard reiterates ‘no decisions made’ on the future of the Centre 67 site. Points to social housing stock being built in Wrexham. (Reading between the lines that could well be the outcome)

— Wrexham.com (@wrexham) February 4, 2020

Cllr Pritchard said: “I am surprised to be sitting here today with this call in, as I did speak to the local member and I will repeat again that he supported the demolition”.

The ‘special’ Executive Board debate was secret, with debates usually kept private. Cllr Pritchard did reference the secret debate, noting that Cllr Marc Jones apparently ‘confirmed’ the previously referenced support for demolition during that recent secret meeting.

Cllr Jones replied noting: “When we met, I was presented with the only option was demolition.

“When I was subsequently informed that there were two offers on the table, one was for a training academy and one was to turn it into apartments. Both of those were high six figure sums of money.

“When I became aware of that, I made it clear that I wasn’t in favour of demolition until those two options have been exhausted. As far as I’m concerned, those two options have not been exhausted.”

“I think I’ve made it clear in the call in that I’m 100% in favour of social housing.”

Cllr Pritchard disputed if there had been commercial discussions, ‘we have not had those conversations’, “We haven’t had a discussion to sell it off for the highest price. We haven’t really had a discussion on what’s going to be on there.”

Temporary Chair Cllr Morris acted as peacemaker noting that a ‘marketing exercise’ had been referenced historically for the site, “That may be where the expressions of interest came from.”

Cllr Harper enquired why the local councillor had not been formally consulted, pointing to the council constitution as why she thought it should have been part of the default process. Other councillors in the room murmured agreement that implied they thought such notifications should be standard.

The Council’s Legal Officer noted it is probably part of ‘standard procedures in relation to the dealing with assets’ rather than the constitution.

Cllr Pritchard acknowledged it ‘is in the checklist’, with the implication it had not been done in this case and was down to a council officer rather than him.

The debate progressed to the Part 2 secret session, and we can’t report what happened there as press and public were asked to leave the chamber.

Meeting now moving to Part 2 private session to discuss future of the site & other matters. Press and public gallery being cleared as a result. (Entire contents of press & public gallery: us.) 30min longer meeting than was expecting!

— Wrexham.com (@wrexham) February 4, 2020

We are led to believe that the committee have not referred the decision back to the Executive Board and therefore the decision to demolish the building as agreed last month stands.

A video of the public part of the meeting is below: