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  #1  
Old 04-22-2014, 05:28 PM
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 457
Default Council Consultations

So the Wales Audit Office have now officially stated what many people on this Forum have been saying for a long Wrexham Council don't consult and even worse don't listen. With all of the resources at their disposal a 0.5% response rate is appalling - clearly only a very small percentage of their own workforce could be bothered.
With over 10% of the population from another ethnic background then how is the Council even attempting to make links with them in alternate language. There have also been problems in the past for the visually impaired and hearing impaired community in Wrexham who have complained they do not have engagement.
I suppose in the Councils favour we should see how they compare to other Councils in Wales are they better or worse (although does seem difficult anyone could be below 0.5%).
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  #2  
Old 04-22-2014, 07:46 PM
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 1,028
Default Re: Council Consultations

Being asked by Wrexham Council to fill in a Survey Monkey questionnaire doesn't equate to proper consultation.
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  #3  
Old 04-22-2014, 07:57 PM
wxm wxm is offline
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 507
Default Re: Council Consultations

The 'competition' Wrexham has to measure itself against is the standard of education and skills by which it's people can attain good earning jobs within a 3 to 50 mile radius of Wrexham. The businesses and jobs it can attract into the County. And of course the care it provides to those in need, especially the elderly, but all whether suffering a long or short term disadvantage. The measure of a consultation is the cause and effect ...what cause do our current policies have on the people of Wrexham, what change should we effect, and how do we measure delivery. Who is at home in Wrexham tonight in need, and society is not there to help
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Old 04-22-2014, 11:10 PM
Liam's Avatar  
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Smithy Lane Estate
Posts: 308
Default Re: Council Consultations

Remember the city status 'consultation'? Ask for the public's view, don't like what they have to say so cite lack of response as a reason to go ahead with the bid.
Mike Davies and zinger like this.
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  #5  
Old 04-22-2014, 11:18 PM
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 90
Default Re: Council Consultations

Can I just save the Council some bother on one point and say that I do not - I DO NOT - want any of my money spent "consulting" with 10% of people in a language that is neither English or Welsh. I don't see why we should pay for services in any other language never mind "consultation". And haven't we got this a**e about face? isn't the 0.5% a reflection of the fact that people just can't be bothered with local politics rather than a failure to "consult"? What's the turnout in a local election? 20%? How many people could name their councillor? That's not due to a communication issue - it's because people get on with their lives and frankly don't care. It's their choice. We don't need a nanny state intefering in private decisions. personally I throw every piece of unsolicited political mail straight in the recycling. Just doing my bit for the environment.
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Old 04-23-2014, 10:06 AM
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 197
Default Re: Council Consultations

I did try to complete an on-line consultation on the Council's web site some time ago and gave up because it was complex and difficult to understand. I suppose that puts me in the 99.05% of the population who came to the same conclusion or did not bother. There must be a better way to consult, or is it me being a little cynical in that the Council WANT to put people off responding. I agree with Ferret that we should not be spending any money on consulting with people who can not be bothered to learn one of our languages. If they haven't been here long enough to learn one of them they surely should not have the right to influence local decision making.
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Old 04-23-2014, 12:01 PM
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 301
Default Re: Council Consultations

Well well, we seem to have two prospective UKIP members on this thread!
The ethnic minorities that form part of the makeup of the residents of the WCBC area have the same right to be consulted as any other person resident here and I would welcome their input.
It has been stated twice that no money should be spent on consulting in other languages and essentially, unless they speak English or Welsh, they should be disenfranchised from the process of consultation.
If the figure of 10% is to be considered accurate as a representation of population who do not speak either English or Welsh as a first language, why, when only 12.3% of of the population consider themselves Welsh fluent, is it necessary to provide bilingual communication (Welsh/English) 100% of the time?.
Ethnic minorities have a right to be here and a right for inclusion in the democratic process. Not my statement, but the law.
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  #8  
Old 04-23-2014, 02:03 PM
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 197
Default Re: Council Consultations

BenjaminM....no one is saying that ethnic minorities do not have the right to be consulted, only that they should adapt to the language and laws of our country. Does anyone have any information on the stance of other countries where non native residents have the opportunity to be consulted?
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Old 04-23-2014, 02:08 PM
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 576
Default Re: Council Consultations

Quote:
Originally Posted by BenjaminM View Post
Well well, we seem to have two prospective UKIP members on this thread!
The ethnic minorities that form part of the makeup of the residents of the WCBC area have the same right to be consulted as any other person resident here and I would welcome their input.
It has been stated twice that no money should be spent on consulting in other languages and essentially, unless they speak English or Welsh, they should be disenfranchised from the process of consultation.
If the figure of 10% is to be considered accurate as a representation of population who do not speak either English or Welsh as a first language, why, when only 12.3% of of the population consider themselves Welsh fluent, is it necessary to provide bilingual communication (Welsh/English) 100% of the time?.
Ethnic minorities have a right to be here and a right for inclusion in the democratic process. Not my statement, but the law.


You appear to be intermingling different ideas here and providing a misleading picture.

Firstly, you are correct. All those people who are entitled to participate in the democratic process and who are within the Borough ought to be consulted.

Secondly, on the Welsh language. Love it or loath it, the Council is governed by the specifics of the Welsh Language Act and this will become more significant as time goes along due to its morphing nature.

Thirdly, on other languages and ethnic minorities. Whilst the Council may be obligated to consult, I don't think (though you may correct me) that they have to do so in any language beyond Welsh in Wrexham or Wales. As far as I know (and I may well be on shaky ground here) this is a discretionary thing
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  #10  
Old 04-23-2014, 03:03 PM
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 301
Default Re: Council Consultations

Yes Alun, I fully understand that it is a legal obligation for Councils and utilities to provide communications bilingually (both written and oral) because of the Welsh Language Act and I am sure you can guess which side of the fence I am on that one.
Regarding consultation in other languages, you are correct, it is not a statutory obligation but in the interests of inclusion and in an attempt to assist in the formation of a cohesive society, it is, shall I say, advisable.
I lived in a Spanish speaking Country for a number of years and although I was able to understand the basics, in no way can I say that I mastered the language sufficiently for all eventualities.
I think it very probable that the majority of British when abroad, think that they are able to speak in a foreign language by using a raised voice and adding an 'a' to every word.
To expect all to 'adapt to the language and laws of our country', yes, I agree to the laws, but language is a different matter and can only occur over a period of time. It doesn't just happen when a plane lands in Liverpool or a boat arrives in Dover. I wouldn't mind betting that some of the people who have that expectation would be lost in a foreign country if they weren't visiting it on an 'all inclusive' basis.
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