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  • in reply to: £1.7 million cat adoption centre #137905

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    Participant

    [quote quote=137899]I have no problem with building a new shelter. I just feel that £1.7 million is rather excessive. Is the purpose of the shelter to collect stray cats or for re-homing them?

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    Their aim is to rehome cats to suitable homes. But if they are not rehomed they will remain in the shelter because Cats Protection does not euthanize healthy cats.
    Honestly, I don’t know whether £1.7m is excessive for this project or whether it’s a typical amount for a project of this size. I trust them that this is a necessary cost – I can’t imagine why they would ‘waste’ money on a building if it used funds that would otherwise be used to help cats – I trust they believe this project will enable them to help even more cats. I imagine they are looking at the long term – it may be a large initial outlay but that doesn’t necessarily mean that Cats Protection (and cats) won’t reap benefits from this shelter in years to come.
    Cats Protection provide an all-encompassing service, as in they are a responsible organisation. There will be measures to ensure that cats can’t easily ‘escape’, and it is highly unlikely this building or its inhabitants will be a nuisance to its neighbours. They don’t just take cats in for the night then turf them out during the daytime (sorry, I couldn’t resist!).

    in reply to: £1.7 million cat adoption centre #137892

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    Participant

    I donate to Cats Protection and other charities (mainly animal charities), and I am quite happy for them to spend money on a new shelter. I feel confident that they make decisions that are in the best interests of the cats – otherwise I wouldn’t donate. Their current shelter is too small.
    Not sure about Zinger’s suggestion of inflicting the ‘homeless’ on the cats. But I suppose it would give them something to do during their long empty days – perhaps they could volunteer to help with chores at the shelter.
    I also consider the Arts Hub a waste of money – I would certainly not have willingly donated to that, but as jimbow says we didn’t have a choice.

    in reply to: Wrexham Council #137764

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    Participant

    [quote quote=137763]Bubble – you sound like a very bitter person.
    Your posts are all very personal, and attack me, rather than debate the subject. I wonder why this is?
    Two possibilities spring to mind immediately, there are others.
    [/quote]

    Oh no, do tell. What are these possibilities?

    in reply to: Wrexham Council #137761

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    Participant

    Wow, Angie, it turns out you DO have an opinion on why addicts’ families are not helping them.

    Addicts are known to be deceitful and manipulative in their quest to feed their addiction (though I’m sure when you sit amongst them they speak only the truth). Addicts ruin lives – those of their families, and of their neighbours and their own. Not just a little bit, but devastatingly. Yet your sympathy seems focused on only the visible ‘victims’. Presumably it pricks at your conscience seeing these people out in the open – but you are not so bothered at the plight of the hidden victims, who are not to blame for the situations they find themselves in.

    Your letter to Hugh Jones does not at any point mention drugs or addiction. You use the more sympathetic term ‘homeless’ – and I don’t believe for one minute that is by chance. Their homelessness is a symptom of their addiction. Personally I think you would get more support if you were open and honest about what the problem is for these people – your decision to characterise them as homeless without once acknowledging their addictions weakens anything else you say – if you spin the truth on this how can we believe you on anything else? By failing to acknowledge their addictions you have handed the council a gift – why would your comments on the ‘homeless’ be taken seriously when you cannot even acknowledge a major feature of the problem in Wrexham – the council could choose to take the view that you don’t understand what the problem is, or alternatively that you’re trying to pull the wool over people’s eyes.

    You came on this forum with your take on the ‘homeless’ problem in Wrexham. You cherry-picked the information you drew attention to. You had to be asked – and then asked again – whether you would be happy for them to live next door to you, where you would have them live, and why their families weren’t helping them. And when people do not share your views you have implied (or even sometimes claimed outright) that they are uninformed and heartless. So much for not judging.

    I don’t think you have the slightest idea of how devastating addicts’ behaviour is to their neighbours. It is relentless – not just now and again. I certainly don’t think you give a second thought to how insulting and hurtful it is to people like me, to hear do-gooders appealing for sympathy and understanding for these people.

    Have you contacted service providers and offered volunteers to supervise their buildings during the daytime so that addicts have somewhere to go? If the council takes them off the streets and places them in social housing, would that be sufficient for you? You don’t want them living next door to you – and whilst I don’t suppose you’d specifically want them to be given a regular tenancy right now, I expect that if they were, you would rather see the life of someone like me ruined by their behaviour than see them homeless. Would you set up a help group for us?

    I work with homeless drug addicts. Not because I like them or even because I want to help them – but because I was sick of hearing the sanitised version of events from people like you. So now I get to see for myself what goes on. It’s been a real eye-opener.

    in reply to: Wrexham Council #137718

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    Participant

    Angie, do you have a view on why these people aren’t being helped by their families?

    in reply to: Moving "services" out of the town centre #137717

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    Participant

    This problem is never going to be fixed; there just isn’t the will to fix it, only to offer sympathy (to the addicts rather than those adversely affected by them) and make excuses (complex issues, takes time,etc). I think the police introduced the PSPO as propaganda. The PSPO is supposed to make the public feel that the issue is being taken seriously. The public are not supposed to notice that the PSPO is not being enforced.
    These services won’t move elsewhere – I expect when their night shelter buildings were first approved it was on the basis of claiming to alleviate the drug problem in Wrexham. No other area of Wrexham will now believe these services do that and be willing to accept them. These services offer addicts a bed for the night and then turf them out into the surrounding neighbourhood during the day – therefore wherever the services are sited, the addicts will loiter, and it is the people living near to those services that will suffer as a result. After seeing what’s happened to Rhosddu, no one’s going to want these services co-located in their neighbourhoods.

    in reply to: Wrexham Council #137599

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    Participant

    [quote quote=137147]
    I ask you now – what if it was one of your children, or grandchildren that had made a wrong choice? What then? Would you be so quick to condemn?
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    We don’t necessarily need to imagine about how we might behave towards these people IF they were our relatives – it is already clear that these people have effectively been abandoned by their own relatives and friends. I doubt this was an easy decision. How bad must the situation have become for a family to prefer their relative to be living on the streets or in a tent than to provide them with shelter?

    [quote quote=137147]
    Last night, during 70mph winds and battered by torrential rain, they had no shelter save for a tent.
    If the council had left dogs in the dog pound in those conditions, the town would be up in arms.
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    Personally, I think the dog analogy is a bad one. Dogs have very little autonomy – their living conditions depend entirely on humans and what we provide them with or permit them to do. Also, if they are deemed to be violent and beyond redemption, they get euthanized; they don’t get given chance after chance.

    in reply to: Moving "services" out of the town centre #137475

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    Participant

    In fact, it annoys me that we’re told a sob story about how the empty days with nowhere to go are unbearable for the ‘homeless’. I fill my days with work. I would love to have every day off. If I became bored I could volunteer for charity. Or go to the library and read or use a computer – this would give them a warm place to spend their time. But they would of course have to adhere to rules and acceptable standards of behaviour – things that they seem determined not to do.
    Is it, as alluded to in JP’s post, really necessary for society to provide them with food, shelter and something to do during the daytime? These things are not provided to me. There is a distasteful sense of entitlement – everything should be handed to them on a plate while they behave however they like.

    in reply to: Moving "services" out of the town centre #137473

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    Participant

    [quote quote=137469]
    Yes, the hospital area is another good example, although a bit closer to town. Anywhere as long as it’s not in the retail centre and as long as it’s cheap. Maybe somewhere along Ruthin Road?

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    If I lived on Ruthin Road or one of the streets along there, I would be mortified at this suggestion. I don’t understand why there isn’t already joined-up thinking amongst the service providers involved. I don’t think these service providers give two hoots about the economic impact on the town centre or to residents having to live near this day after day. They’ve already co-located themselves in a particular area.
    In fact, why aren’t Tŷ Croeso and Tŷ Nos open during he day? [Tŷ Nos is of course stating in its very name that it only intends to cater for the night time.] These buildings are wasted space during the day – could they not get enough volunteers to staff the buildings during the day so that addicts have a place to go?

    in reply to: Open letter to Hugh Jones #137339

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    Participant

    [quote quote=137266]

    They can be housed next to me when they’re ready to take that step – at the moment they’re not and need a lot of support.

    So if they’re not ready to be housed next to you, where would you have them housed?

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    Angie?

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