April 2, 2019 at 11:21 am #166173
It is an issue that false information is put all over the place. People are not stupid, it is just that the press misinform them, and this has a negative effect on democracy.
Murdoch gives his Sun away free in some areas. It’s not some special offer, but every day for a long period of time. Why do you think he’s doing that?April 2, 2019 at 11:29 am #166174
I think you are under the misapprehension that the role of an MP is to follow blindly the vote of his/her constituents. The job of an MP is to provide leadership,to exercise his/her judgement and to see each issue against a wider context. Your comment about A* grads is frankly, silly.
That is what Ian Lucas is undoubtedly doing with regard to the Brexit farce.
It may be contrary to many opinions but, parliamentary democracy is the best way of managing our affairs as a nation, irrespective of referenda results for the reasons I stated previously.
The N.I. backstop is not the only reason that May’s deal has been rejected 3 times so far, but you would realise that if you had read more widely.April 2, 2019 at 11:38 am #166175
I agree mainly with BenjaminM. I’m no particular fan of Ian Lucas and generally take a dim view of most politicians, but our MPs are elected to make decisions on our behalf, not to do as we say. No MP can carry out the will of all of his/her constituents since their constituents have so many different opinions to each other. Even amongst people who voted for Brexit, opinions differ. Ian Lucas cannot please everybody so perhaps he’s doing what he thinks is in the best interests of his constituency and the UK.April 2, 2019 at 11:50 am #166177
I agree mainly with BenjaminM. I’m no particular fan of Ian Lucas and generally take a dim view of most politicians, but our MPs are elected to make decisions on our behalf, not to do as we say. No MP can carry out the will of all of his/her constituents since their constituents have so many different opinions to each other. Even amongst people who voted for Brexit, opinions differ. Ian Lucas cannot please everybody so perhaps he’s doing what he thinks is in the best interests of his constituency and the UK.
On other issues I would agree, but on this particular issue if every MP voted the way their constituencies voted it would be all be done by now, the bottom line is that the majority of MP’s are trying to stop Brexit full stop including Ian Lucas.
The truth is incontrovertible. Malice may attack it, ignorance may deride it, but in the end, there it is.April 2, 2019 at 12:18 pm #166179
Cheap shot Benjamin, you sound like a lapdog for Lucas yourself…?
I actually started this thread and most of the contributions have been thoughtful and interesting. For the record I voted to ‘remain’, however I lost. I knew what I was voting for and I was fully informed of what ‘leavers’ were voting for, despite these political lightweights having us believe that ‘leavers’ did not know what they were voting for..! As for Mr Lucas, he is the worst of the lot, I will not be voting for him that’s for sure.April 2, 2019 at 12:19 pm #166180
As you state none of the MPs have come up with a solution. Where are the MPs who said it would be easy, trade deals would be in place by Brexit Day, more money for NHS etc?
If it was easy, no doubt the Prime Minister who gave us the referendum, would have remained in post to see it through.
As many others have stated, our MP is there to make rational decisions on our behalf. I expect him to use his education, experience and knowledge to read what’s on offer, weigh up the pros and cons and vote accordingly. It won’t satisfy everyone, but that is the democratic system we have.April 2, 2019 at 12:29 pm #166181
It won’t satisfy everyone, but that is the democratic system we have
42,000 V 28,000
The truth is incontrovertible. Malice may attack it, ignorance may deride it, but in the end, there it is.April 2, 2019 at 12:42 pm #166182
Yes, the majority voted out. That is not disputed. But did people vote out under certain circumstances or out under any circumstances? Even of those who voted out in Wrexham won’t all be satisfied.April 2, 2019 at 12:57 pm #166183
Surely it is pathetically trite to single out one person out of 650 who have overwhelmingly rejected May’s deal as being bad for the individual, the Country and the economy.
Benjamin you hit the nail bang on the head there. MP1953 if we can use your favourite 42,000 Leave V 28,000 Remain figures.
I know this thread is mainly squared at Ian Lucas, but this applies across criticism handed out to MPs across the board online and offline. The Wrexham Brexit result covers both Wrexham and also Clwyd South which is where a large number of us reside in. So Susan Elan Jones is also equally responsible for parliamentary representation of so called Brexit wishes for this area.
Yet most interestingly everyone seems to want to drag Ian Lucas through the coals. Susan Elan Jones is also a massive Europhile – probably even more so than Ian – she actually abstained on the Common Market 2.0 vote last night – which is a Brexit option that Ian did support.
However, nobody has hounded Susan on Twitter and given her death threats, nobody has constantly harangued her about her decision making over Brexit. I don’t see a thread about her on here?
It’s not that those of us in Clwyd South are completely politically disengaged and therefore never discuss our MP. Just look at how much talk our AM Ken Skates generates.
Now this isn’t an invitation to go pitchfork anyone as Susan is a decent MP in my books and does a lot for her constituents. It just begs the question why Ian Lucas has a Brexit lightning rod? Perhaps it is because he is more confrontational over the issue?
There are several other “Arch Remainers” in Labour who have not received the vitriol that Ian has.April 2, 2019 at 1:08 pm #166186
P.s. Those moaning – well you should have all voted for and campaigned harder for Andrew Atkinson and pushed him over the line. He was 100% for Brexit all the way.
I did not see a single person on here or on Facebook or Twitter or in the press backing Andrew and his Brexit views. Andrew was your once in a generation chance to get rid of Labour from town. He was the bookies favourite and Election statistics mathematical certainty to take the seat.
Why do you think all of the Labour activists gave him such a hard time?
There is almost no chance that Atkinson’s replacement will ever command enough voters to beat Lucas. There are a very vocal number who say they will never vote for Lucas again, but there’s a silent majority that like MP1953 says will vote in their local Labour candidate to keep the Tories out. It’s been over 100 years now of no Tory MP in Wrexham.
So Andrew, I know we don’t and will probably never see eye to eye, but you can know this, that you would have been a hell of a lot popular now with your views as an MP in this current Brexit deadlock and debacle.
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