Vaccine roll-out – Where & how many?

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  • #198600

    MP1953
    Participant

    Well, Stanley Johnson has had the second part of the vaccine before many vulnerable people have had the first.

    And Lionel Blair ! doesn’t seem right, and I know the key word is patience, and that they say that it is all done proportinate but North Wales especially does seem to be lagging behind the rest of the UK

    The truth is incontrovertible. Malice may attack it, ignorance may deride it, but in the end, there it is.

    #198602

    TimRegency
    Participant

    “Musings of an anonymous, pissed off virologist.”

    This is a virus with a known propensity to mutate. Semi-immunising people for 12 weeks seems staggeringly dangerous to me.

    #198655

    zinger
    Participant

    He is entitled to his opinion. I guess that you had to trawl the internet to find him.

    376,459 have died n the USAto date. Are they taking the same approach as the UK?

    #198656

    TimRegency
    Participant

    He’s an established qualified virologist. I seek out expert opinions.

    • This reply was modified 3 months ago by TimRegency.
    #198658

    Matt
    Participant

    I think this is where I have a problem, “having to trawl the internet for something” does not make something less valid because it is difficult to find. Just look at the BS flying in our face all the time that is easy to find, does it make it somehow more valid. Like the constant lies spouted by Donald Trump are impossible to avoid unless you live under a rock.

    Back in the day scholarly people would spend days studying information from obscure texts in libraries and because of their level of education and knowledge and wisdom they were dealt the respect they deserve.

    It’s just beggar belief in this day and age with the internet and social media that it’s a shouting match of whoever speaks loudest and insists that their truth is the ultimate truth that other less well known and carefully considered opinions, even those of experts can be so easily and casually dismissed because it’s convenient to filter out any information that doesn’t fit into a particular world view.

    We wonder why the country and the world is in the mess it is. We’re told by millionaires and the privately educated elite that Eton Men make good Prime Ministers and nobody questions that logic because they’ve been told by their “betters” that this is how it should be and they should vote for them.

    Then we see a massive mess and disaster unfold in front of us and we know it’s a disaster because New Zealand have been back to normal for several months. In Wuhan where it all began they were able to celebrate New Year in huge crowds.

    In the UK and the United States where 2 of the biggest egomaniac self serving political leaders we have ever seen are in charge, we see and ALLOW the tragedies that have unfurled seeing countless lives being lost to the point where it’s gone completely out of control.

    Weak and ineffective lockdowns, confusing sets of inconsistent rules up and down the country, deliberately ignoring experts, encouraging people to go out and eat out and go abroad over the summer, policing cuts over 10 years so nothing can be enforced.

    Knowing back in September that it wasn’t safe to open the schools up because of asymptomatic spread from children to more vulnerable family members. Now with the vaccine roll-outs they are literally making it up as they go along.

    The media have told everyone that this absolute disaster is normal and people are so blinded by statistics they don’t care that 1,325 people died today. For most, it wasn’t a loved one so the number becomes meaningless. Yet if someone was tragically stabbed or shot by a terrorist and they had a face to them the country would be up in arms and demanding that this should be stopped and never happen again. How are people trying to stop Covid? Bloody going out and giving out empty claps again!

    There are thousands of Pfizer vaccines being wasted every day because people aren’t turning up to get them and they have to be used on that day. Also, people who are the most vulnerable and could die in a few weeks from Covid are turning down the vaccine because they don’t want a foreign one and want the British Oxford one. It is peak stupidity, but utterly horrible as countless people getting infected now and dying could be getting these vaccines that are being wasted.

    The way things have been handled in this country will be deemed utterly unforgivable when we look back on it.

    I know some people are going to turn round and say *But Drakeford* but that’s like complaining about a mouse nibbling at your cheese in the pantry when you have a rampant bull loose in your living room.

    Fingers crossed, despite all of this there should be light at the end of the tunnel if enough people can be vaccinated over the year before next winter when perhaps we have to do all of this over again.

    #198659

    Matt
    Participant

    You only need to look at sad stories this reported on Wrexham.com

    13 residents at Wrexham care home pass away after coronavirus outbreak

    13 out of 53 residents have died in recent days from Covid.

    Now some people think that Covid is no worse than Flu. So there can be a comparison with Covid, here was the findings of a medical study.

    Results. A total of 168 individual outbreaks were reported from 28th July 2016 until 27th March 2017, affecting 1459 residents and 347 staff. There were 76 hospital admissions and 37 deaths among care home residents reported from all outbreaks.

    https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0033350618301987

    I’m not being funny but 37 deaths from 1800 people across multiple sites over a duration of 9 months from Flu sounds significantly less deadly than the current Covid outbreak and the care home example above. But of course people aren’t bothered and choose to believe what they want to believe.

    #198660

    zinger
    Participant

    Well Matt, are you saying that all four Chief Medical Officers of the UK are not able to make an informed decision? Doesn’t say a lot for our education system if we have four uneducated men at the top of their profession.

    #198661

    Matt
    Participant

    Nice straw man argument there, that is clearly not what I was suggesting.

    #198662

    Matt
    Participant

    While we’re on the topic though, all 4 CMOs are largely in bought and paid for political positions, rather than being capable of providing unbiased and independent medical and scientific appraisal of the situation in hand.

    So because Johnson, Sturgeon, Drakeford etc… all wanted to follow the political line shared by all the main political parties of SCHOOLS MUST REOPEN IN SEPTEMBER AT ANY COST.

    They all effectively led themselves down a blind alley and made a very narrow focus on the potential harm of Covid on children and not the actual more devastating effect of having schools open with no social distancing and bubbles of hundreds of children and multiple bubbles all travelling on the same busses to schools.

    https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-britain-idUSKBN25J08J?edition-redirect=uk

    Data has shown the sheer volume of spread of infections between children from classrooms into homes and then to wider family members through support bubbles then hitting vulnerable family members and allowing the snowball that became an avalanche now of the second wave.

    Loads of parents called it, loads of teachers called it, in fact people were practically banging a drum about it. Yet the 4 Chief Medical Officers signed off health measures in a joint statement that allowed this to go ahead. So they may have intellectually and academic smarts, but in terms of being used as a political pawn they are equally as malleable as any expert the Government wants to bend to their policy. Whitty and co do not lead, they are just there to sign off any dodgy protocol that their taskmasters want.

    If distance learning is so harmful to kids, why was it done fine between March and July and it’s now fine to do it between January and February half term? The argument quite simply doesn’t add up. It’s just it is politically and economically inconvenient for kids at home rather than it being the most sensible medical approach to preventing the rampant spread of Covid.

    The amount of entire classes and teachers in any given school forced to self isolate in any given month between September and December across the UK was a complete farce.

    They are honestly blindly chancing this vaccination hocus pocus on a hope and a prayer – things need to be done properly. I just hope for the sake of the vulnerable and front line workers getting vaccinated now that things don’t go horribly wrong.

    If someone told me the very tried and tested and solidly trialed and researched course of vaccinations that my kids went through was instead that they may or may not get the recommended boosters in a few months time and they were going to mess about with different vaccines, I’d tell them to get f*cked and pay to have it done privately.

    That obviously isn’t possible at the moment with Covid, but it puts into context how messed up the situation is. In a way I’m glad I’m somewhere between 15m and 39m on the list to be done as hopefully things will be a bit more certain then.

    #198663

    Matt
    Participant

    Large number of doctors highly concerned with the vaccination approach.

    https://www.gponline.com/cmos-seek-reassure-gps-12-week-covid-19-vaccine-gap/article/1703552

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