Still wasting our money, does anyone care?

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  • #135135

    Dick
    Participant

    Welsh trade union ‘pilgrims’ are costing the taxpayer more than £2 million per year, an investigation reveals today. Public sector workers on ‘facilities time’ (paid time-off taken by trade union officers to carry out union duties) are employed by almost every one of the 38 public bodies in Wales. Around 80 such officers across Wales are employed full-time, working a total of 2,978 hours per week – at a cost of approximately £2.1 million a year. An additional 153 officers are employed on a part-time basis to carry out trade union roles. If each member of part time staff worked just one day a week on union ‘facilities time’ it would cost the taxpayer an additional £1.03 million. Shadow Local Government Secretary and Aberconwy AM Janet Finch-Saunders said:
    “The taxpayer shouldn’t be picking up the tab for Trade Union duties – that’s what their subscriptions are for. Across Wales, public bodies are taking difficult decisions about staffing and funding in order to protect vital services. Meanwhile, millions of pounds in vital funds are being diverted away from the frontline to subsidise the political work of the unions. It’s a national scandal.”
    The investigation – carried out under the Freedom of Information Act by the Welsh Conservatives – comes after Guido reported a Taxpayers’ Alliance study revealing the national bill for pilgrims now stands at more than £15 million. David Cameron’s government began a crackdown on pilgrims, Theresa May should finish the job…

    #135137

    99DylanJones
    Participant

    Part of an FOI on the cost of Unions

    Corporate & Customer Services (Human Resources) Department does some of the information requested.

    1. Thank you for your reply re Union Facilities; I am seeking clarity on the following – You refer to staff being on secondment to the Unions — what is the cost to the Council for this time – I am assuming that there is a cost as you only refer to the Unions paying for administration.

    Annual budget – £52,900 for 3 seconded officers, representing the Council’s three recognised trade unions. This includes superannuation, NI on costs plus costs on resources.

    Full response:- https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/union_facilities#incoming-469426

    10th January 2014

    #135139

    99DylanJones
    Participant

    https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/union_facilities#incoming-469426

    FOI January 2014 showing how much Unions cost ratepayers in Wrexham

    Corporate & Customer Services (Human Resources) Department does some of the information requested.

    1. Thank you for your reply re Union Facilities; I am seeking clarity on the following – You refer to staff being on secondment to the Unions — what is the cost to the Council for this time – I am assuming that there is a cost as you only refer to the Unions paying for administration.

    Annual budget – £52,900 for 3 seconded officers, representing the Council’s three recognised trade unions. This includes superannuation, NI on costs plus costs on resources.

    #135142

    BenjaminM
    Participant

    “Still wasting our money, does anyone care?”

    Not in the slightest. This facility has been in existence since 1975 by virtue of the Employment Protection Act 1975, further endorsed by Trade Union and Labour (Consolidation) Act 1992 and again by the Employment Act 2002 and applies equally to both the public and private sector.

    Are you and Janet Finch Saunders actually suggesting that Public sector employees should not have the same rights as those in the Private sector?

    I fully understand that during the summer recess AM’s and MP’s try to hang their hat on some obscure minutiae that has little relevance or cost implication just to keep their name ‘up there’ and why Dick, if he is who I think he is would endorse such drivel.

    #135188

    Dick
    Participant

    It’s got nothing to do with workers rights. The trade unions are awash with money so why should the taxes i pay on my pension subsidise them, if someone wants time off for union work then let the union pay for them.
    Glad to see you think it’s drivel and that £2m cuts are minutiae whilst no doubt lambasting WCBC for any cuts they make.
    What difference does it make who i am, it doesn’t change anything or are the only people allowed to comment have to be approved by you?

    #135191

    Matt
    Participant

    Perhaps if Janet Finch-Saunders is so concerned about wasting our money, she should be askng her party serious questions about the levels of progress on Brexit that is being made, with an annual bill of £100m now underway for Liam Fox’s bloated international trade department, with his 2,841 staff and David Davis’ Brexit department and its 300 staff.

    So far they’ve sent Article 50 and that’s it. The rest of the time, they go on a jolly to Brussels, get laughed at and then get sent home. They have absolutely no clue what they are doing and that is something far more people care about, than some contrived dig by the Tories to yet again attack the public sector and trade unions.

    #135192

    MP1953
    Participant

    It’s got nothing to do with workers rights. The trade unions are awash with money so why should the taxes i pay on my pension subsidise them, if someone wants time off for union work then let the union pay for them.
    Glad to see you think it’s drivel and that £2m cuts are minutiae whilst no doubt lambasting WCBC for any cuts they make.
    What difference does it make who i am, it doesn’t change anything or are the only people allowed to comment have to be approved by you?

    Ah yes Benjamin, belittling people who have a different opinion from him once again :(

    The truth is incontrovertible. Malice may attack it, ignorance may deride it, but in the end, there it is.

    #135193

    MP1953
    Participant

    It’s got nothing to do with workers rights. The trade unions are awash with money so why should the taxes i pay on my pension subsidise them, if someone wants time off for union work then let the union pay for them.
    Glad to see you think it’s drivel and that £2m cuts are minutiae whilst no doubt lambasting WCBC for any cuts they make.
    What difference does it make who i am, it doesn’t change anything or are the only people allowed to comment have to be approved by you?

    Ah yes Benjamin again belittling anyone who has a different opinion from him/her once again :(

    The truth is incontrovertible. Malice may attack it, ignorance may deride it, but in the end, there it is.

    #135195

    Dick
    Participant

    Perhaps if Janet Finch-Saunders is so concerned about wasting our money, she should be askng her party serious questions about the levels of progress on Brexit that is being made, with an annual bill of £100m now underway for Liam Fox’s bloated international trade department, with his 2,841 staff and David Davis’ Brexit department and its 300 staff.

    So far they’ve sent Article 50 and that’s it. The rest of the time, they go on a jolly to Brussels, get laughed at and then get sent home. They have absolutely no clue what they are doing and that is something far more people care about, than some contrived dig by the Tories to yet again attack the public sector and trade unions.

    Glad to see you’re an expert on the Brexit negotiations.

    How can pointing out that OUR money is being wasted be construed as a dig at Public sector workers?

    #135263

    Matt
    Participant

    Perhaps if Janet Finch-Saunders is so concerned about wasting our money, she should be askng her party serious questions about the levels of progress on Brexit that is being made, with an annual bill of £100m now underway for Liam Fox’s bloated international trade department, with his 2,841 staff and David Davis’ Brexit department and its 300 staff.

    So far they’ve sent Article 50 and that’s it. The rest of the time, they go on a jolly to Brussels, get laughed at and then get sent home. They have absolutely no clue what they are doing and that is something far more people care about, than some contrived dig by the Tories to yet again attack the public sector and trade unions.

    Glad to see you’re an expert on the Brexit negotiations.

    How can pointing out that OUR money is being wasted be construed as a dig at Public sector workers?

    It’s called doing a basic Google before getting involved in a discussion, something you no doubt also had to do to begin this post. No expertise required to see what a car crash Brexit negotiations currently are.

    Your initial post is having a huge accusatory dig at 80 full-time and 153 part-time public sector roles across Wales, implying that if money is being wasted then the money should be cut off, which means these people would lose their jobs. If the money existed elsewhere to fund the positions then that would be the case. Many people completely disagree that trade union representatives are wasted money, so there is no scandal at all.

    If we want to talk about scandals, perhaps we should talk about the Conservative use of Welsh call centres during the election?

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